Sandra Palmer - Part 2 ( The 1972 Titleholders Championship)

Music playing  00:00

Mike Gonzalez  00:15

So let's just recap the professional career if we can of one Sandra Palmer turning professional in 1964, at the age of 21, she had 28 Professional wins, including 19 on the LPGA Tour, that is T-29. On the list of all-time, the winners on the LPGA Tour, a couple of wins on the Japanese Tour, which we'll talk about, money leader and player of the year in 1975. So money leader, our listeners will get a kick out of  this was $70,000. But you joined the tour in 1964, a couple of big majors, we're going to talk about winning the 1972 Titleholders, which was the final edition of that event as well as the 1975 U.S. Women's Open with a couple of close calls following we are going to touch on those as well. But what a career tell us a little bit about what it was like those first few months out on tour.

Palmer, Sandra  01:15

Well, pretty scary, actually. You know, I was just I'd never played at that level. And not sure if I mentioned that. My friend Sandra Haynie, I knew Sandra when I when we were just teenagers. And she was my really my only friend on tour. So you know what, once you get out on tour, it's you just go off by yourself, I guess I don't know. You know, it's like you're not following people around. Where do I go? Well, I guess I did have to ask where you go. But it's so different than it is today. I mean, I'm not even sure I knew where the hotels were, I guess they gave you a list of where to stay you and you You did everything you had to get there. There were no courtesy cars. And so it wasn't it was not easy. But you know what, when you're young and you're following your dream, who cares? So off we went. You remember that? Don't you bruise?

Devlin, Bruce  02:22

I sure do. And you know, you made a you made a very valid point there where you were you mentioned that you learned your golf on the tour on the LPGA Tour. And and it's an it shows up in your in your record. It took you a while before you broke through to a victory. But like you said, you're probably learning all the way still making a little bit of money. But tell us about that first victory.

Palmer, Sandra  02:50

Well, I can't remember where the well my first victory. Japan was in Japan that gave me a lot of a lot of confidence. I was I don't know, I had a friend that owned. His name was Jiro Yamato and he owned a golf company called Rainbow Golf. And he invited me to, to go to Japan and I guess he's the one that got me the invitation to play in that tournament and the men. Lanny Wadkins was there. And I think Lee Trevino, that was an experience, maybe you

Devlin, Bruce  03:32

still is today.

Palmer, Sandra  03:33

You still telling some of the same stories he told back in 1970. And they're still funny. He's, he's a great, he's great. So anyway, in that particular tournament, the women played in between there would be, maybe the men would tee off and then there would be the women playing and then there'd be another man's though. So that was a big deal that that I won that tournament, I don't know. You're familiar with Chako Higuchi. She's in the World Golf Hall of Fame. And we became really good friends through that tournament. But anyway, at that time, Chako was, she was getting ready to play in over in the States, and at that time, you could play either the small ball or the are the big ball. That's what we called it the larger ball today. And I remember asking, Harvey, I said, Well, which ball should I play? And he said, he told me the work. The advantages would be for the small ball that goes farther flies lower,

Devlin, Bruce  04:53

straighter,

Palmer, Sandra  04:55

straighter Yeah, a bar, but it wasn't as good around the green means. So I decided because if anyone's ever played in Japan, it's very, very windy over there. And I played the smaller ball, but Chako was practicing and getting ready and her turn but she played the big ball. So she'd hit that ball up in the way in a corset which would take it but I probably wouldn't have been beaten her if she had been playing the ball that she was normal. But anyway, I did. And it was a big thrill for me. And we were good friends. So that that gave me some confidence when I came back to the back to the states to play.

Mike Gonzalez  05:38

Of course, we're talking about the 1972 Tokai classic. Oh, yeah. Yeah, so first professional when it was a 36 hole event for the women and 72 holes for the men. You remember what first prize was?

Palmer, Sandra  05:53

Well, probably wasn't very much, but I have to say I was getting a I did get a little stipend to come over there to fly. So it probably didn't matter to me if I if I won. How much was it?

Mike Gonzalez  06:07

Your stipend was probably

Palmer, Sandra  06:08

even back in 1970. I think they probably paid me 30,000 or something to come. I have no idea why thank you Jiro. He was my agent.

Mike Gonzalez  06:20

Yeah, well, Bruce, you can tell her how much the men got and how much the women got?

Devlin, Bruce  06:24

Yeah, it's very interesting. It gives us a great insight of, you know, the early days of the LPGA compared to the to the PGA Tour. So in that particular tournament, Sandra won $1,000 As a first prize. So you're gonna tell me who won the men's? They only received 10 times that?

Palmer, Sandra  06:45

I think it was. Yeah, I wonder what what do you think they paid Lee Trevino to come over there?

Devlin, Bruce  06:52

I bet they played me more than

Palmer, Sandra  06:57

I was trying to say I think Curtis Strange was there too.

Mike Gonzalez  07:01

Okay. Yeah, yeah. Well, let's talk about that first. LPGA win, which probably served as validation for that first victory in Japan as well. This is the 1971 Sealy LPGA Classic is a program at the old Desert Inn by two over Ms. Caponi?

Palmer, Sandra  07:23

Yes. We were there quite quite a few years to Yeah, I was. I'm not exactly sure how I stood going into the last hole. But it was a a celebrity. You played with the celebrity too. And I played with Joe Namath. And that was really fun. He was great. He's a very good golfer. And he was wonderful to play with. And all of the gals were excited to see him he had beautiful blue eyes. So we all were excited to have all these celebrities flying in our event. But anyway, I was able to reach the green, or you could reach the green on the last haul. But I hit it into the, to the right hand bunker and I took this one of the greatest shots I've ever hit out of the sand and it took one bounce to bounce right into the hole. So I guess I went back and saluted Donna. He was standing out in the fairway. I guess so anyway, but it was I think the prize was $10,000.

Mike Gonzalez  08:33

Okay. Tell you what that was. It was big money back,

Palmer, Sandra  08:38

then. Yes, that was the largest one. So.

Mike Gonzalez  08:41

Yeah. So that's, you know, you were probably nearly seven years on tour before you got that first LPGA win. So what was the mindset coming in? I mean, you probably felt better having one in Japan. But that's it's a lot of learning.

Palmer, Sandra  08:56

You know, it is and you know, every tournament, yeah, you know, I believe you're just trying to get yourself into contention. And you know, that usually it never starts to the last nine holes, even today, so but I don't know, you know, you just like said I just would grind it out and try to get better. I had a very good short game back then. And I didn't hit a lot of cricket shots. So you got to fire up that putter. So that's how it started transcript. You know, I guess after that I started having my getting a little bit more confidence. You know, the better you hit those shots, give yourself more chances. And, you know, started believing in myself.

Devlin, Bruce  09:44

Well, it didn't take you long to validate here in the States either because you you want to get in 1971 at the Heritage Open at Heritage Country Club in Connecticut, where you beat your Japanese. That was Higuchi

Palmer, Sandra  09:59

Chako. Oh yeah. I remember that I had a guy to make a putt on the last few holes. I played it pretty well that way. She was a wonderful player too, by the way.

Mike Gonzalez  10:07

Yes, sir was, yeah, we'd hope to get her on the show sometime. That would be great. Yeah. Before we get into your first major, which was the title holders, that was May of 29. I want to ask you about something else that happened in 1972. And that was the the issue that came up with Jane Blalock.

Palmer, Sandra  10:27

Yeah, that was kind of, uh, well, Janie and I were were were good friends. And, you know, I don't know, it's such a it was just a horrible thing to Well, let's go back. First of all, the LPGA. At that time, we didn't have rules, officials and all that the players did everything. We had a commissioner. Right. But the play, you know, there was somebody that marked the Golf Course. And I think one year I was statistician, I kept everyone's record. And so there had already been a case after Janie was accused of moving the ball on the green. And I don't really know exactly who that was that said bad. It just, it just ballooned. You know, I think today, it could have been handled, you know, a lot a lot differently. And it was and it just sort of ruined a lot of friendships out there. Because if you were friends with Janie or even talked to her parents who were terrible to her parents, it didn't have anything to do with this. But that's just, you know, that's just the way it is. But I suppose one of the worst things that could happen is if you're accused of cheating. And anyway, it was finally settled. And, you know, still a lot of hard feelings. And I don't know, today have you know, and Janie's won like 27 times. And in my mind, she deserves to be, you know, Hall of Fame. For the LPGA. I don't have enough wins to get into the LPGA. I had to go into the world and which was. So you know, it's the hardest Hall of Fame that there is to get in. But anyway, there was just some bad blood. So

Mike Gonzalez  12:30

yeah, because you were and there weren't many you are a staunch defender of

Palmer, Sandra  12:35

so? Well, I just, you know, I don't know, it just seemed the way it was handled was not the best. So you have to have a friend somewhere along the way that stands up for you

Mike Gonzalez  12:46

to do well. Probably some good things came out of that, though,

Palmer, Sandra  12:50

did great things came out of it. We had a

Mike Gonzalez  12:53

governance changes, right, right. Got a

Palmer, Sandra  12:55

board board of directors, all the things that that big organization like that should have, but you know, the tour has just evolved so much, or, you know, through not just with, well, more so with the money, but just in general, how many people that have worked and formed and now and the caliber golf courses that they play, and it's just extraordinary.

Mike Gonzalez  13:18

You look at the record that Jane Blalock posted and every lady that won more tournaments than her is in the World Golf Hall of Fame.

Palmer, Sandra  13:28

Yeah. Well, it just reminds me of Pete Rose, you know, yeah,

Devlin, Bruce  13:33

I mean, that's the truth. So yeah, I don't know.

Mike Gonzalez  13:36

Well, let's talk about the 1972 Titleholders Championship. Now this is a this is a major that some of our younger listeners probably not even familiar with, but it was your Masters in a way because it was conducted on the same Golf Course for many, many years at Augusta Country Club just right. Just looking down down the hill at the big course.

Palmer, Sandra  13:57

Exactly. I played I believe it was my first year. I played Augusta Country Club and you know, that they used they said that Augusta Country Club was was harder than where have you ever played it? I have played it. Yeah, yeah. Really hard. I mean, it had here I am from Texas, you know, and so, you know, there's not hardly well the Hill Country and Austin is kind of hilly, but here I'm you know, I'd never played on a course like that, you know, where you have to aim it the right rough and you also you know, the greens were so rolling. And that was another thing that was so hard for me coming from Texas, you know, going back east because the grass, the bit grass, the ball would sit down in that red bent grass, and I was used to the Bermuda and it sits up a little bit better. So that was a big learning experience for me to to, you know, I'm kind of a sweeper, so when I swing so when that ball would sit down in that grass It was always hard, but yeah, Augusta Country Club was really tough. And

Mike Gonzalez  15:05

1966 was the final year it was held there. And then for some reason, you may know they brought it back for one year and that was the 1972 Titleholders.

Palmer, Sandra  15:17

Well the I don't really remember why it was necessarily that was the only year I guess it had to do with the money. But at that time, well, Pine Needles the course is different now. They've redesigned it and so forth that wouldn't even have been back there and I don't even recognize a lot of the halls but Bullet Bell set the Golf Course up. We played from the back of the tees and we see a that I shot. I'm not sure it was around here was probably one of the best rounds I've ever played in my life. He and he would say he could not believe that I that I shot that and I think I held out a I own a par four I held my second shot out on one of the holes on the back nine. I don't know what happens. You know, sometimes you just go. I didn't even have scoreboards out there. So I didn't even know what I was doing. I just played and then coming in. Maybe I realized the last hole or two I had a substantial lead. So that's kind of nice.

Devlin, Bruce  16:29

You just snuck in didn't you.

Mike Gonzalez  16:33

kind of wanted squeaker there Bruce. Oh my gosh,

Devlin, Bruce  16:36

yeah. Only one by 10 shots. Yeah, we made a couple of pretty fancy players to Judy Rankin. And Mickey Wright. And he's second.

Palmer, Sandra  16:46

Like I said, I didn't even know you know, sometimes you know, you, you're better off not to know too much.

Mike Gonzalez  16:52

So just to give our listeners an appreciation for how good a scoring record this was across a very tough course. Only player in the field to finish under par. Next two players. Were 10 back. But then if you go to JoAnne Carner, who finished tied for 10th. She was 19 shots back tied for 10th. So you guys kind of lap the field.

Palmer, Sandra  17:22

It was a tournament that will stand the test of time, I guess for me. I'm very proud. I'm very proud of that. And I have a nice trophy to show for it. So I'm not sure

Mike Gonzalez  17:33

Bruce, if we've talked anybody that had a 10 shot lead in a major walking down the 18th hole. How does that feel?

Palmer, Sandra  17:42

Well, like I said, it feels great. I mean, I you know, it doesn't matter how much you win by getting as long as you win by one shot, right. You know, just one of those things that it's hard to explain.

Mike Gonzalez  17:56

Yeah. Well, if there were, if there was any knowledge of where you stood on the 18th tee that had to be a pretty leisurely walk down the last.

Palmer, Sandra  18:03

I'm sure I was nervous. You know, it's like, Why do you get nervous when you're playing so well? Yeah, sometimes you did.

Devlin, Bruce  18:11

You do. You still had another win? In 72. You and Jane Blalock won the Angelo's Fourball Championship. Tell us about a new one for me. I've not heard of that before.

Palmer, Sandra  18:29

Well, it was a team event. And it Cape Cod. Yeah. Janie. It was it Cape Cod? Yeah. And, you know, for a lot of years in there, this is a little thing. It's it was considered a major win. And then a few years ago, they decided to, to eliminate that as a as not an official or I shouldn't say an official tournament. And then, in fact, Beth Ann Nichols wrote a article about it in in golf week, not too long ago, about what happened to those two tournaments that should be considered official. Official wins because and then and then they decided that they were unofficial. Well, today. Now the players play in a same kind of a format and if you win, they're considered official wins. I don't get it.

Devlin, Bruce  19:36

Sometimes it's hard to undo. Okay.

Mike Gonzalez  19:40

What can we say? The subject will come up again, as we talk about,

Palmer, Sandra  19:44

but I could use those two, you know, who couldn't do Yeah, then that would help me with something else that I would like to get into.

Mike Gonzalez  19:53

Yeah, but we've talked often about the arbitrary decisions made as to when's the Dinah Shore start as a major and the Du Maurier a start as a major, right? Yes. It impacted a lot of people terms their major. It certainly does. Yeah, yeah. Well, let's go to 73. Bruce, that was a pretty nifty year for Sandra Palmer.

Devlin, Bruce  20:17

I'll say we only had six victories in 1973. Starting off with TV. Whew, how do you spread the Shizuoko Central Ladies in Japan?

Palmer, Sandra  20:31

Oh, central ladies classic. Yeah. Suzuki, wasn't it? Shizuoko? Yeah, that they made? Didn't make motorcycles and they still are they still in business? So

Devlin, Bruce  20:45

it's spelt a different way? Oh, if it's Suzuki, it's spelt a different way. It's S H I Z U O K O, okay. Let me show you why that was.

Palmer, Sandra  20:58

So I don't remember a whole lot about it. I didn't get a motorcycle. Wrong tournament, wrong tournament. But you know, over there, it's kind of it's fun, because you well, back then you didn't ever would consider taking a caddy anywhere with you. Gosh, you know. And when you go to one of those clubs, you know, all the golf courses are out in the countryside. And so, through the years of traveling, I don't know if the men do this, but we had to take buses. And it probably take you an hour to make at least an hour at one time. I think we took I took a taxi to the train station. And then from the train station. The other destination was on a bus. You know, some of those were they were the golf courses, you couldn't even drive you know, they you could only be in a car, I guess the roads are so narrow. And so it's always been a challenge there. But But anyway, I was trying to say that when you get there, and I'm not even sure how you get your caddy, I guess they're assigned to you. But they have these uniforms and not Paulus my first time there to to have that experience. I think I asked Paul is Hollis, how do you find your caddy? And she says, Well, I think she's looking for you. And be sure and she's got a white cap on with a blue. You know, I didn't know. So I walk out there and there's like 100. So, anyway, but the caddies were really good at it. It's just amazing. What you pick up, I mean, back then they didn't No one spoke a lot of English. And they might on the Golf Course. Tell you like a put a bow up like this. And that you would put you would put to the pot rope to the right you would she would put her finger on the right edge of the circle she was holding up. And that's where I should play the pot or something. But they didn't say no. And they had these Korai greens, which are kind of hard. They're they're pretty slow some of them. But yeah, and then you know, when you would hit if you hit it out of bounds, they would make a big bet hold up a big circle around your head. And that meant obey which was a horrible sign to get.

Mike Gonzalez  23:33

Alright, so I've got to ask you, where are you on bus number one or bus number two

Palmer, Sandra  23:38

is always on the fun bus, whichever one that one was?

Mike Gonzalez  23:42

heard a lot about it.

Palmer, Sandra  23:45

Yeah, we had a lot of music and a lot of beer. And a lot of stories. In fact, you know, a lot of times you the camaraderie was so much fun when we would go to to Japan because sometimes you when you're on tour, you might not even see your best friend always because you have different times and so everybody kind of goes their own way. But in when you go out of the country, you're kind of thrown in together and you know, you eat your meals together and and the bus rides were fun and the stories were great. And I can remember on one time I was paired with Joan Joyce, I don't know if you remember, Joan Joyce is a famous softball pitcher. But anyway, I had played with her and you never meet anyone that was any more enthusiastic than Joan. And I'm sitting next to her on the bus and she starts telling me about her round that she did this. She did that and I said Joan, I saw every bloody shot you hit the day I played with you. So anyway, through the years we always had a big laugh about that. Bless her heart.

Mike Gonzalez  25:01

Heard a lot of great stories about those bus routes. Oh, yes. Yes

Palmer, Sandra  25:05

indeed.

Devlin, Bruce  25:06

Even heard some stories about the moon coming up, didn't we?

Palmer, Sandra  25:10

Oh, I don't know that. She did that. We better save that for

Devlin, Bruce  25:21

later. Right.

Mike Gonzalez  25:22

So were you were you in any the karaoke contest?

Palmer, Sandra  25:25

Up? I don't know. I was kind of shy. Probably not. But I had lots of laughs

Mike Gonzalez  25:32

Well, it sounds like you guys had so much fun on those longer bus rides to and from the Golf Course in Japan. Let's let's go on to Pompano Beach Classic at Pompano Beach Country Club. Up lady we talked to yesterday. Oh, really? Betty Burfeindt.

Palmer, Sandra  25:48

Oh, good for you. How is it good?

Mike Gonzalez  25:50

Yeah, she's, she's wonderful. One thing I asked her I said, Betty, I said, you know your names come up a lot on our podcast. Did you have a lot of second place finishes? She says she did.

Palmer, Sandra  26:02

She said yeah. She's was a long hitter. Yeah, that's what we heard the first one to reach the she probably told you this the 18th hole at Mission Hills with an iron. Whoa. She had no she was the first one. I was there. I saw it. But she she has she was a really good athlete. You know, I don't know. So how some people are managed to weigh in and some you think should win more don't? Yeah, maybe it's who knows? Oh, self confidence or something. So

Mike Gonzalez  26:38

what she kind of major and she got a few wins. But she had a lot of second she says a lot of close calls. Yeah. Yeah. So you won with a birdie on the first hole in the playoffs? That

Palmer, Sandra  26:52

don't remember it was a good Golf Course. I remember that. And I lived in Boca Raton at that time so was good to be sleeping in my own bed and and play that Golf Course. No, I don't remember I did I do remember the last pot that that I had to make a pot to beat to beat her did she remember much about that? Dare I ask what she said?

Mike Gonzalez  27:25

I don't remember now. Look at the transcript

Palmer, Sandra  27:30

well, you can always think you know I was thinking the other day i I wish I knew then what I know now. Oh my gosh, some of those tournaments I played in. In particular, the one we'll be talking about later on, I think was the 1976 playoff with JoAnne Carner so if I just knew then what I know now. I think I could have won that.

Mike Gonzalez  27:56

Well that may come up later

Palmer, Sandra  28:02

what could I have done

Mike Gonzalez  28:03

but in the meantime, you go from this February win to a may win way up in Minnesota at the Keller Golf Course the St. Paul Open and that was by want to get over Jane Blalock and Judy Rankin

Palmer, Sandra  28:17

Well, good for me. That's a that's a that core still is in existence. And somewhere along the way a few years ago I had a lady come down that belongs to that club. And in in the clubhouse you know the main plank there I don't know if Bruce you did where are you? I played Do you know what a small greens Yeah, a lot of big true

Devlin, Bruce  28:41

on there the year

Palmer, Sandra  28:44

well, anyway, you're how come you didn't win that one? That's right. Anyway, they have pictures of all the past champions still up in their bar area I heard but that was Patty Berg country of course. Sure was and after that one year. It was called the Patty Berg Classic, but she would come out and and support that, that tournament. And that was a real big thrill for me. I just was I had great admiration for Patty Berg. She was not only a great competitor, but she did those clinics those Wilson clinics that were so funny and and one year at the PGA Show. She was signing autographs and ever in the people were lined up blocks and every time someone came up no she was she was not a young whippersnapper then and she would just get up out of her chair and shake. Shake their hand. But if you came up with a golf ball, other than a Wilson ball, there's no way she would sign

Mike Gonzalez  29:59

up did 1000s

Palmer, Sandra  30:02

Yeah, she did. Oh, she was funny.

Mike Gonzalez  30:05

Did you go to Florida or clinic school? No, I

Palmer, Sandra  30:07

wish I could have I think he sort of had to be on their staff staff would like to have been in fact, I think I tried to talk her into letting me come, but it didn't work. Yeah,

Mike Gonzalez  30:21

yeah. When she did her clinics at the tournament sites, I understand that they'd line a few of the other professionals up and she'd put you guys through your paces, you know, you hit a hook, you hit a cut, you hit a Oh, yeah.

Palmer, Sandra  30:33

Well, it's pressure. You know, I think back then you had to kind of do that a lot more. I don't know that players do that. Now. They just hit the ball at the hole, you know, maybe you, you tell me and maybe it's the equipment or that you can't spin the ball. But that's one thing Kathy Whitworth could do. If that pin was she would work that ball into the hall. That's how you get to Carnegie Hall, I guess with those 88 wins.

Mike Gonzalez  31:01

Thank you for listening to another episode of for the good of the game. Please, wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify. If you like what you hear, please subscribe. Spread the word. Tell your friends until we tee it up again. With the good of the game. So long, everybody

Music playing  31:22